Episode 53– New Suicide Bill Lacks Rope and Plastic Bags

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Gun Lawyer Episode 53 Transcript


suicide, firearm, gun, gun rights, ammo, ammunition, suicide hotline, shortages, guns, law, gun owners, person, people, lawyer, domestic violence, kinds, hunting, second amendment rights, black powder, powders


Evan Nappen, Speaker 3

Evan Nappen 00:16

Hello, I’m Evan Nappen. Here is an interesting news bit. A good friend of mine, John Petrolino, wrote an article, titled “Bill Introduced To Require Dealers To Include Suicide Hotline Information.” I am a big fan of John and everything he writes, and it is really interesting that he is pointing this out. He brings to our attention that there is a new bill that has been filed. It is H.R. 5436: Gun Suicide Prevention Act. Let me just take a step back for one moment and tell you that suicide is a serious and real problem. I am not in any way saying it isn’t. If anyone needs help, they need to go and get help. It’s not about that. But what I do want to talk about is how I see the issue of suicide and the technique that the anti-gunners use all the time to take something that we all believe in and are serious about, and any rational person is in favor of trying to do something about, and then turn it into an anti-gun push.

Evan Nappen 01:45

Yet another cut in their death of a 1000 cuts that they want to do to our Second Amendment rights and to us. On its face, it appears incredibly well intentioned, and how can anyone be against it. But once you realize that there are consequences and ramifications that are never brought to the surface by these people, then you start to see exactly what was behind their plan and why they do it. There are many topics that are very sympathetic, like who is in favor of domestic violence? I do not think anybody should be able to abuse and harm another person. I completely understand that. Yet, they structure the domestic violence laws in such a way that we end up having anybody with a domestic violence restraining order, making a restraining order a federal firearm prohibitor. Think about that. Originally, it was just convicted felons. That is after a jury trial and it’s a serious offense. Then down this slippery slope to domestic violence misdemeanors. Now a misdemeanor becomes a firearm disqualifier and then, still falling down that slope, a restraining order becomes a firearm disqualifier. A civil action done in a summary manner; no jury trial, nothing. You now are a federally prohibited person. They put it all into the package of something that we can all believe in, and that is trying to stop domestic violence. But it ends up impacting dramatically on gun rights and suicide prevention is again in that same playbook. If someone is suicidal, I want them to get the help they need, and I am sure you do, too. It affects so many. I think everybody has somebody in their life that has been touched by a suicide, and it is a really important issue.

Evan Nappen 03:54 Page – 2 – of 6

But now, this bill is proposing to put on every gun box for every gun sold in America, the suicide hotline. That’s right. Here’s from the news release. I will read it to you. “Congresswoman Julia Brownley announced the introduction of the Gun Suicide Prevention Act to address the prevalence of suicides by firearms, particularly among veterans. This bill would require firearm manufacturers and retailers to include labels that provide the number of the National Suicide Prevention Lifeline.” There you go. Every gun box is going to have the suicide prevention hotline on it. Well, I’ll tell you what; why are we stopping there? I think every piece of rope sold in America should have the suicide hotline tag on it. Every electrical cord sold in America needs to have the suicide hotline tag on it. Every razor blade sold must have the suicide hotline number right on it. Every pill bottle must have the suicide hotline. Every car and exhaust mechanism in every car needs to have the suicide hotline. Every plastic bag that you could put over your head has to have the suicide hotline. Every knife sold. Think about it. Every bridge, every tall building, every social media website where you might get depressed looking at, every aggregate news site or every television set has to have the suicide hotline because who watches that and doesn’t feel upset. Everywhere because there is an uncountable number of ways that one can kill themselves. So, we better put that suicide hotline everywhere.

Evan Nappen 06:23

Oh, why wouldn’t we do that? Because here they are taking a focus and making a statement to make it appear that the primary use of a firearm is for suicide. You know, interestingly, among suicides, the preferred method of suicide amongst women is pills. This has more implications than even what it appears on its face. Not only is it a slam against guns, an issue that we all care about, but also, we care about suicide prevention. This is positioned, of course, to equate guns and suicide all the time. On every gun sold. We have seen suicide used by the anti-gunners, particularly to argue for gun control in states that have low murder rates. Because in states that have very low murder rates, they cannot sell gun control in terms of stopping homicide. So, they say, look, it is about stopping suicide. Then they have the whole thing. The means matter. That is their approach, means matter. How you kill yourself is what matters. Not that you want to kill yourself. But how you kill yourself; means matter. So, blame the gun. This is, again, part of their strategy. They even try to get dealers into this fold so they can give out this information and perpetuate that guns cause suicide. As you all know, suicide is not because of guns. Suicide is much deeper and important mental health reasons that are there, and those things need to be addressed. People need to have help; no question about that. But this linkage, guns to suicide, is really abusive.

Evan Nappen 08:45

Then there are ramifications that I can show you in the law. Because when you call, you should find out what happens if I call this National Suicide Prevention Lifeline. Well, you can look right online and read it. What happens is when you call them, you are sent to the local Crisis Center. They have these local centers all over the country. Your call is sent there. So, now they can, of course, reach out to local authorities very easily, and this is where you can face police intervention. Now they say a small percentage end up in interventions, only a small percentage. I am sure the prevention hotline itself is well intended. I am not saying it isn’t. But you know what they say about good intentions, right?

Evan Nappen 09:47 Page – 3 – of 6

But here’s the kicker. New Jersey passed a law that is called The Duty to Warn Law, what I call healthcare confiscation law. This law, which is mirrored in other places and promoted in conjunction at times, as it was in Jersey, with so-called Red Flag, mandates that health professionals (psychologists, psychiatrists, doctors, nurses, therapists) report a person if they believe this person has indicated any intent to harm themselves or others. They have to call the police. Otherwise, their licensure and their professional qualifications are in jeopardy, if they fail to report. I have experienced in New Jersey clients that have been absolutely slammed with this being sprung upon them. I had one case, fairly recently, where this person had contacted a state senator to assist in getting unemployment benefits that had not been paid for 15 months. After 15 months of this, this person became so utterly frustrated with the lack of progress, actually said hyperbolically, what do I have to do; hang myself to get my money? Just an expression, a hyperbolic expression.

Evan Nappen 11:29

Well, that’s all it took. Because that office contacted the health professionals, and they came to the person’s house. The senator’s office said that this was done, and lo and behold, this person was dragged off to be evaluated mentally. They were held for two days, and in the process, guns are seized on healthcare duty to warn and a TERPO (Temporary Extreme Risk Protection Order) was filed. The person medically, guess what? No problem whatsoever. No treatment needed. No drugs needed. No problem, but it didn’t matter. They said this statement and that is what led to it but released with absolutely no issues. We still had to fight in the system to get their gun rights back and to get their guns back. This came from just saying something like that. Let me warn all of you. Never say to anyone – You know, I am so upset I could kill myself. Never say that. Never say I am so mad I could kill that guy or I’m so upset about it. If you make any kind of statement like that, it is the equivalent of making a bomb joke at the airport. Okay, you cannot do that.

Evan Nappen 12:59

I have had plenty of cases where the hyperbolic statement, I’m going to kill that person or I’m going to kill myself, ends up a basis for firearm seizure, loss of gun rights, your house being searched, firearms seized, and then having to battle to regain your Second Amendment rights. The laws are in place that make this happen, particularly in places like New Jersey. Let me just tell you New Jersey’s red flag law, you think well, thank God, I don’t live in New Jersey. In a way that is absolutely true if you don’t live in New Jersey. By the way, President Brandon, as he’s now being called, said that he wants these model red flag laws for the country. Guess what state he is saying illustrate the model gun laws? That’s right, New Jersey’s laws, which just defy and deny due process, and do the damage before there is any due process. Take away your guns, take away your license, raid your home. All these things take place before you have even had one chance to say anything to a judge at all about your case.

Evan Nappen 14:27

This is the modern times for gun owners where you got to be aware of these things, these pitfalls and these traps. Again, maybe you are suicidal and you need help, please get help. But you also need to understand the ramifications of these acts. When you take certain steps and you may face these other consequences, you have to make that decision which is best for you. Again, I am not demeaning or putting down or anything about suicide. Because it’s serious, and we all want to do our part to see that no individual takes their own life. You know the old saying about suicide being a long-term solution to a Page – 4 – of 6

short-term problem, and it is true. Many people that have been brought back from the edge are thankful that they have been and that is all good stuff. But its impact and its use by the anti-gun forces cannot be ignored. Not to talk about it does a disservice, and I know that you, my listeners, want to hear the truth. They want to hear realities about these things and that is my purpose in talking about these things. When we get back, I want to talk about this ridiculous hunting ammunition shortage.

Speaker 3 15:57

For over 30 years, Attorney Evan Nappen has seen what rotten laws do to good people. That’s why he’s dedicated his life to fighting for the rights of America’s gun owners. A fearsome courtroom litigator fighting for rights, justice, and freedom. An unrelenting gun rights spokesman tearing away at anti-gun propaganda to expose the truth. Author of six best-selling books on gun rights, including Nappen on Gun Law, the bright orange gun law Bible that sits atop the desk of virtually every lawyer, police chief, firearms dealer, and savvy gun owner. That’s what made Evan Nappen America’s Gun Lawyer. Gun laws are designed to make you a criminal. Don’t become the innocent victim of a vicious anti-gun legal system. This is the guy you want on your side. Keep his name and number in your wallet and hope you never have to use it. But if you live, work, or travel with a firearm, that deck is already stacked against you. You can find him on the web at EvanNappen.com or follow the link on the Gun Lawyer resource page. Evan Nappen -America’s Gun Lawyer.

Speaker 3 17:12

You’re listening to Gun Lawyer with Attorney Evan Nappen. Available wherever you get your favorite podcast.

Evan Nappen 17:27

Hey folks, glad that you are still hanging in there, listening to Gun Lawyer. I really appreciate that you do because it is tougher and tougher to get our word out, to get our message out. They are pounding me with algorithms and shadow bans and all kinds of stuff when you want to talk about these things. Remember the old First Amendment? Well, the mainstream media seems to have forgotten about that and our social media sure has. So, this is a great way to hear things you would not normally hear about and hear it from someone who is in the field, in the trenches, dealing with it every day in the real impact on real people. Please subscribe anywhere you can get a podcast. You can find Gun Lawyer on iheart, CBS radio, Spotify or Audible. Subscribe and stay tuned as we give you important information that can protect your Second Amendment rights.

Evan Nappen 17:29

If you have ammunition, consider yourself lucky, and I would not be blasting a lot of it willy nilly at the target range these days. As much as I love target shooting, beware, and if there is ammunition that you need and you can find it and I would highly recommend just buying it even the 9 mm. My friend, a dealer who has quite a great relationship with his supplier, is telling me that his wholesale price on 9 mm is $18 a box. So, prices, even when you can get it, are just incredibly expensive. If you are a new gun owner and you missed the boat prior in owning guns and socking away ammo, I do feel for you, but do your best to get something that will shoot. This is difficult times for us. Hopefully, when the American manufacturing muscle is exercised and we get back to being what we all remember about living in this great capitalist country, we will be able to stock our ammo boxes back up and really enjoy Page – 5 – of 6

getting out and target shooting and hunting again. But till then, this is Evan Nappen, reminding you that gun laws do not protect honest citizens from criminals. They protect criminals from honest citizens.

Evan Nappen 18:03

We are in a situation right now where there is an incredible shortage of hunting ammunition. I know we went through the drought on ammo a number of times. Remember the shortage of .22 rimfire that was quite a period. We could not get any of that. Then after the scamdemic hit, lo and behold, what do we see? Shortages across the board of all kinds of defensive calibers, 9 mm etc. Ammo became very hard to get and still is incredibly pricey if you can find it, of course. Because there was a dramatic, absolutely dramatic, increase in firearm purchases and first-time purchasers. Record numbers of new gun buyers. America has never seen anything like it as firearms flew off the shelf. People buying and buying and NICS checks hitting record numbers. Of course, folks like that want to buy ammo. All the gun owners want ammo, and it became more and more difficult to get it.

Evan Nappen 19:52

Now you combine the supply shortages, the supply chain shortages, the manufacturing shortages, the staff shortages, you cannot get employees, the ability to distribute all these things, and inflation as well. All these things that have been brought in and put upon us since President Trump left office. We have been dealing with it, and I am sure that you have experienced many of these things. Well, it has affected very seriously the ammunition market. So, today, if you want to buy hunting ammo, it is basically impossible to get 20-gauge slugs, 12-gauge slugs, particularly Sabot slugs, forget it. Trying to get 30-30 ammo is an impossibility. All the hunting caliber ammo, 30-06, .308, .270, is dried up. Just talking to a dealer friend of mine, the price per box, talking a box of 20, not a box of 50, 20 30-06 hunting ammo, is over $50 a box for your classic 30-06 deer hunting ammunition and that is if you can get it.

Evan Nappen 21:29

We are really being hit hard on this, and it is troubling because a lot of our great makers have gone through all kinds of turmoil, Remington particularly. Even though they are supposedly back in business, we still do not see the product and trying to meet that demand with all these things working against them. More people than ever wanting ammo, and more people actually wanting to hunt now during these troubling times. It is a very difficult situation and it is not just hunting ammo. Also, getting powders and primers is impossible. Trying to get 209 primers for your inline muzzle loaders, good luck, it is not out there. Speaking of muzzle loaders, it is basically impossible to buy black powder now. Because GO-EX quit making it and went out of business.

Evan Nappen 22:36

The powders that are out there, some are imported, but it is not filling the gap. So, if you want your muzzle loader, or use black powder, or a reenactor or anyone enjoying muzzle loading and black powder shooting, you won’t be able to find black powder anymore, it’s gone. Hopefully we will see it come back at some point. But it is basically unobtainable at the moment, and it makes you wonder if it doesn’t come back, if these things stay gone, if situation gets even worse, we may have to fall back to making our own black powder. I hope not, and I am not recommending that anyone make their own black powder. But if you want to have the information on how to make your own black powder, it is out Page – 6 – of 6

there. Again, I am not recommending or saying you should. But just having the information handy is not such a bad idea, and there are actually some interesting books on it.

Evan Nappen 23:41

One of the better books is what are called the Black Books. The Black Books are actually reprints of the United States government printing and publishing by the Frankfort Arsenal of how to improvise weapons. They have quite an explanation and how to make homemade black powder. You can find these books online, probably the best is a company called, and I have no interest in this company whatsoever, I am just pointing it out, Delta Press. Go to Delta Press, and they have the three-volume set of the Black Books, which are a reprint of the Frankfort Arsenal government publications. They have all kinds of interesting things in those books that I am sure you will find fascinating, and one of them is, of course, on black powder. Our founding fathers had to make their own black powder at times. It is something that is been done by man for a very long time. A lot of the folks look at these books and they are like, hey, maybe I should have a set for when the shaving cream hits the fan. And that’s not a bad idea. Knowledge is important and can be a key to survival.

Evan Nappen 25:04

This is the times that we live in. We have shortages, and it is unbelievable thinking that this is America. If you have been to the stores, you see how empty the shelves are, how all the products that we took for granted are gone, or in such limited quantity, in such sporadic appearances. Everything from our cars all the way down to buying good old toilet paper again. So, here we go. They are blaming all kinds of things for it, but it is affecting the Second Amendment. It is affecting our gun rights. You know, it is hard to exercise your gun rights when you do not have ammunition. Some people speculate that maybe it is all part of the plan. I don’t know whether that’s true or not, and I sure hope it’s not, but ammunition makes the guns go. Without the ammo, you have some pretty and very pleasantly made things you can appreciate out of steel, but they are not going to do much for you beyond that, without ammo. Ammo is critical, and right now, it is very hard to find.

Evan Nappen 25:22

Gun Lawyer is a CounterThink Media production. The music used in this broadcast was managed by Cosmo Music, New York, New York. Reach us by emailing Evan@gun.lawyer. The information and opinions in this broadcast do not constitute legal advice. Consult a licensed attorney in your state.

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About The Host

Evan Nappen, Esq.

Known as “America’s Gun Lawyer,” Evan Nappen is above all a tireless defender of justice. Author of eight bestselling books and countless articles on firearms, knives, and weapons history and the law, a certified Firearms Instructor, and avid weapons collector and historian with a vast collection that spans almost five decades — it’s no wonder he’s become the trusted, go-to expert for local, industry and national media outlets.

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