Gun Lawyer Episode 172
hawai’i, law, new jersey, court, second amendment, talk, hawaii, boat, great, supreme court, gun owner, firearm, gun, book, second amendment rights, citizens, carry, gulag, transporting, state
Evan Nappen, Speaker 3
Evan Nappen 00:00
Hi. I’m Evan Nappen, and welcome to Gun Lawyer. You know there are some things I like that come from Hawaii. One of my favorite things that I splurge on that comes from Hawaii is Royal Kona coffee. It’s my favorite coffee. Have you ever had Royal Kona? Oh my god, it’s the best! I fell in love with Kona when I first was working. When I was going to college, I worked in Herder’s Cutlery store in Monmouth Mall, and we also sold, at the time, it was called exotic coffees. This is before Starbucks, before, K-cups, before any of that. We had big barrels of coffee, and the coffee that was actually the most expensive was Royal Kona. Folks would come in. They’d buy knives, and they’d buy coffee. As an employee there, we were able to make pots of coffee. They wanted coffee brewing all day for that wonderful aroma. So, we had great cups of Kona, and I loved Kona.
Evan Nappen 01:30
Of course, this is Gun Lawyer, and it’s not coffee lawyer. But one of the things that recently has come from Hawaii that I don’t like at all, is their recent Supreme Court decision regarding the Second Amendment. It is absolutely giving the finger to the Second Amendment and to the Supreme Court of the United States and to the Bruen decision. It’s just insanity, just insanity. You can’t believe that a Court is going to be that unbelievably disrespectful to a (United States) Supreme Court decision and to an individual’s Second Amendment rights. So that it’s blatant. It’s blatant. Let me tell you what happened here. Hawaii upheld this man’s conviction for carrying a gun. He challenged it under both the Hawaii State Constitution and, of course, the Federal Constitution. Believe it or not, the State of Hawaii has an identical Second Amendment, if you will, an identical right to keep and bear arms to the Federal Second Amendment.
Evan Nappen 03:07
As you may know, New Jersey has no State Constitutional right at all to keep and bear arms – none. That’s why it was so important when the McDonald decision came down in the (United States) Supreme Court because it applied the Second Amendment to the states. The decision in Heller got applied to the states and subsequently, of course, in Bruen. Prior to that, there was no Second Amendment in New Jersey, and the Supreme Court of New Jersey said it was a privilege, not a right, essentially. Now, of course, we’re back to being part of America again in New Jersey. You probably believed that Hawaii was part of America, but apparently, the Hawaii Supreme Court doesn’t think so. So, what the Hawaii Court said was, listen to this, “Article I, section 17 of the Hawai’i Constitution Page – 2 – of 7
mirrors the Second Amendment to the United States Constitution.” Then the court went on to say, “We read those words differently than the current United States Supreme Court.” How do you like that? “We hold that in Hawai’i there is no state constitutional right to carry a firearm in public.” (https://www.courts.state.hi.us/wp-content/uploads/2024/02/SCAP-22-0000561.pdf) Isn’t that something?
Evan Nappen 04:37
Directly rejecting the law of the land. Directly rejecting the application of Bruen and the Federal Second Amendment as it is, in fact, incorporated to the states via the 14th Amendment as per McDonald, as per their decision. The majority opinion was written by the great Justice (Samuel A.) Alito, a Jersey boy, by the way. The Hawai’i ruling is just nuts. Right? Listen to what the (U.S. Supreme) Court said. “There seems to us no doubt, on the basis of both text and history, that the Second Amendment conferred an individual right to keep and bear arms.” This was written in the majority opinion in Heller. In Bruen, the Second and Fourteenth Amendments kick in. Then SCOTUS (Supreme Court of the United States) outlined what’s needed to challenge gun laws, and they base that on what we call text, history, and tradition. Where the scrutiny test is burdened upon the State to have to show by text, history, and tradition, analogice laws from the past that would justify a current law.
Evan Nappen 06:01
The Hawaiian court said, and it’s just astounding. This is the level of jurisprudence, folks. Ready? They cited a line from an HBO drama in their decision. They uphold their rejection of the Second Amendment, no joke, to some degree here, based on an HBO show. Okay? Here’s, the quote. Ready? “As the world turns, it makes no sense for contemporary society to pledge allegiance to the founding era’s culture, realities, laws, and understanding of the Constitution. ‘The thing about the old days, they the old days.’ The Wire, the HBO TV show.” This Court actually sites The Wire! I mean, can you believe that? And think about even what that statement says. The statement is nothing but pure ignorance, pure ignorance, rejection of our tradition and our history, rejection of what is a fundamental right of every citizen. And they base it upon some contorted, bizarre, modern day thinking from an HBO show. I’m not making this up. It’s astounding that a State Supreme Court is going to go against the Federal Supreme Court with that magnificent decision by Justice Thomas in Bruen. Essentially the trifecta of establishing our Second Amendment rights.
Evan Nappen 08:01
The Court says further “We reject Wilson’s” (the person making the challenge here) constitutional challenge,” the Court wrote. “Conventional interpretive modalities and Hawai’i’s historical tradition of firearm regulation rule out an individual right to keep and bear arms under the Hawai’i Constitution.” Really? They rule it out. Fascinating. Then the Hawaiian Supreme Court says, “The spirit of Aloha clashes with a federally mandated lifestyle that lets citizens walk around with deadly weapons during day-to-day activities.” “The history of the Hawaiian Islands does not include a society where armed people move about the community to possibly combat the deadly aims of others.” Oh, really? There was no self- defense. Are you kidding me? Then the Court says further, “Bruen snubs federalism principles. Still, the United States Supreme Court does not strip states of all sovereignty to pass traditional police power laws designed to protect people.” Page – 3 – of 7
Evan Nappen 09:25
Then they reject Wilson on his claim that there’s a violation as well of his Federal Constitutional rights. Can you believe the audacity of Hawaii in giving the finger to the Supreme Court? In giving the finger to the Second Amendment and saying that their citizens in Hawaii have to remain victims. They cannot be defenders. They have to be subjugated to the State crushing their rights, and that the guarantees of the Federal Constitution and their State Constitution, which couldn’t be clearer, that the individuals have that right to keep and bear arms. They reject it. It’s absolutely unbelievable. This is what we’re dealing with today. There is an absolute concerted effort to ignore whatever a State doesn’t like. The rule of law goes out the window. They love to talk about the rule of law, all the time about rule of law, rule of law. Well, that’s great. Part of that rule of law is the foundation of our Constitution where the Supreme Court has established this judicial review and made clear what the Second Amendment means. They just toss it to the wayside because of the aloha spirit and following the logic of an HBO drama.
Evan Nappen 11:18
What is this? It’s just absolutely astounding, and it shows you their level of education in the law. They just have no respect. None. For a court that would do this. It’s pure politics. It’s pure anti-gun politics. It is literally them weaponizing their standing as justices to disenfranchise individuals of their Second Amendment rights. It is nothing short of disgusting, and it lays the groundwork solidly for the United States Supreme Court to hand Hawai’i’s ass to them over this. It’s outrageous. I sure hope they do. And make a statement that can be heard around the world about what level of stupidity the Hawai’i Supreme Court has, when it comes to actually following the law and obeying the Supreme Court, and its interpretations and applying them fairly to its citizens.
Evan Nappen 12:54
Hey, you know, we are proud to be sponsored by the Association of New Jersey Rifle & Pistol clubs. Every one of you, as I’ve said, needs to be a member of the Association of New Jersey Rifle & Pistol Clubs. They are currently battling and prepping for many, many new bills that are being filed in Jersey to, of course, further disenfranchise us of our Second Amendment rights. They try to use every trick and gambit they can come up with to steal our rights. So, who fights for us? Well, it’s the Association of New Jersey Rifle & Pistol Clubs. They’re the number one group in New Jersey advocating for you and me and our rights. They have a full time paid lobbyist in Trenton. They’re keeping an eye out and keeping us alerted. So, those emails can go out, and you can take action. We can fight these ridiculous laws as they get proposed. And it’s the Association that’s in Federal court as we speak, litigating. We should see some results very shortly on the challenge to the so-called assault firearm ban, which really are just modern sporting rifles, and the large capacity magazine ban, which we all know is just standard capacity magazines being banned, and the Carry Killer bill and its efforts to make a carry permit useless by restricting it so much that it has virtually no value. This is what’s going on. It’s the Association who are fighting this. You need to join anjrpc.org. The Association of New Jersey Rifle & Pistol Clubs. The website is anjrpc.org. Join, be a member. Be part of the solution and proud to be part of the fight.
Evan Nappen 15:01
Of course, I want to mention our good friends at WeShoot. WeShoot is an indoor pistol range in Lakewood, conveniently located right off the Parkway. WeShoot is my range. It is where I got my Page – 4 – of 7
certification for my carry permit and so did my brother and my son. So do so many of my friends and listeners. Everybody loves WeShoot. They are absolutely great. They will treat you like family, and I’m not just saying that. They really do. They’re the greatest, friendliest group of folks. You don’t have to feel the least bit intimidated going there. They have tremendous training courses. They have great Pro Shop with everything you can need in the area of guns and shooting. They have great rentals, too. It’s a great way to have a date. Great fun. Go there and enjoy a great day of shooting. You know, our ranges are critical to our exercise of our Second Amendment rights. Without a place to shoot, it’s going to make it tough when you need to use your gun. You have got to train, and you need to have a place to shoot. Places to shoot are hard to come by. And here you have a top facility so convenient right there in Lakewood. From Monmouth, Ocean, and Middlesex, WeShoot is easily accessible off the parkway. I give my highest recommendation to WeShoot. Check out weshootusa.com. That’s their website, weshootusa.com. They have great photography, too. They really do. They really take pride in it. Beautiful photographs, and they run these really cool events. So, check out WeShoot.
Evan Nappen 17:01
I also want to shamelessly plug my book, New Jersey Gun Law. New Jersey Gun Law is the Bible of New Jersey gun law. If you’re a gun owner in New Jersey, you really can’t afford not to have a copy. It’s over 500 pages. That’s right, over 500 pages of question and answer with 120 topics all explained. I mean, the book itself is a weapon. You could hit somebody in the head with it. I don’t recommend it, but in a pinch, if you need to. But anyway, get a copy of that book, because it’ll help you navigate New Jersey’s treacherous waters. It is a reference utilized by everybody that wants to know about New Jersey gun law. And on the front cover, you’ll see a QR code. Make sure you scan that QR code, and for free 100%, subscribe to our free portal so that you get all the updates. You get access to the archive with the past updates, and you’ll get emails of new updates. You’re going to stay on top of it this way. The book stays current. It doesn’t go out of date that way. And you know, it’s my calling here to keep that book current, to make sure individuals have a user-friendly tool. So, if you want to get your copy, go to EvanNappen.com. Yep, that’s my website, EvanNappen.com. You’ll see the big orange book. Just click on it, and you’ll have your copy in days. And you’ll be glad that you did.
Evan Nappen 18:37
So, we have some questions here with Ask Evan. I love the questions. I love interacting with my audience. I really do appreciate you folks. It’s great to have a voice and to be able to communicate these thoughts. And of course, our mission is to educate people so that you stay protected, and you don’t have problems. Mark sent a letter, and it says, my question is, while in my private boat in New Jersey, and I am a New Jersey resident from a town in New Jersey, I won’t even name the town. Is it legal for me to carry my handgun along with my New Jersey Permit to Carry in my private boat on the waters of New Jersey? Thank you. PS I purchased your book and I enjoy it. Thank you.
Evan Nappen 19:42
Alright, well here’s the deal. When it comes to transporting firearms, if we’re talking about not carry permit transport but regular transport under the exemptions, boats are treated similar to cars because you’re transporting the firearm. Therefore, it needs to be cased, unloaded, etc., and you need to be going from one place to another under the exemption, such as going to the target range or going hunting, etc. So, if you’re going duck hunting, you can bring your gun on the boat, and then you can use Page – 5 – of 7
it to hunt if you have a valid license. (N.J.S. 2C:39-6.f.) You know, load it, and use it because you’re on the waters of the State. So, there is an exemption for being on the waters while hunting. If you’re transporting a firearm in your boat, you need to be aware of the exemption and must be cased and unloaded.
Evan Nappen 20:38
But in this case, the question has to do with carrying your handgun, if you have a permit to carry it loaded and concealed on your person. A boat is not a motor vehicle under the sensitive places carry killer law. Now, even if a boat was a motor vehicle, it doesn’t matter, because that section about transport in a motor vehicle, which we call the Car Jacker Protection law, has been enjoined. Meaning it’s not enforceable. It got enjoined because of the efforts of the Association of New Jersey Rifle & Pistol Clubs, who brought the Constitutional challenge and got that injunctive relief, so that we can carry in our motor vehicles. But a boat is not falling under that anyway, even if there wasn’t an injunction. There are no sensitive place restrictions specifically concerning boats. So, if you’re in a boat, it’s the same as being on land in a non-sensitive place. If you’re within the three mile limit, you’re within the jurisdiction of New Jersey, and New Jersey law will not prohibit you from carrying your firearm in the same manner that you carry it while you’re on land. It’ the same thing. So, you can carry on your boat, if you have a New Jersey Permit to Carry.
Evan Nappen 22:12
Now, if you are utilizing the firearm for lawfully target shooting from your boat, if you’re legal and are able to do that, or whatever, that’s a whole other story. You are allowed to target shoot in the woods or fields, as long as what your target shooting with is legal for hunting or fishing. So, I guess there’s an argument that you can use your handgun for shark fishing on a boat. And so, maybe that’s out there for that. But primarily, I don’t think you’re interested in target shooting from your boat with your handgun. You’re really thinking about having it so you can defend yourself should need be, and that is legal. It’s absolutely legal to do that in the same manner as it’s legal while on land. And that is all to be distinguished from transporting, without a carry permit, or even transporting long arms. Those rules apply under the separate exemptions, as we’ve discussed.
Evan Nappen 23:24
So, I want to tell you about the GOFU. You know, every week, we have the GOFU, that’s the Gun Owner Fuck Up. And it’s important because GOFUs are cheap lessons for you and me. If you learn from them, you won’t have to pay the heavy price of the persons that committed the GOFU. And that’s the idea. I don’t want folks getting in trouble. I don’t want you to end up a client. I really don’t. I want you to remain law-abiding citizens and not be put through the shredder of New Jersey’s justice system.
Evan Nappen 24:07
By the way, we talked last time about the Gun Owner Gulag and that case that I had coming up to get my client out of the Gulag. I’ll tell you this. It was a knockdown, drag out fight. The State was trying to keep that citizen in jail. They wanted him to sit there until his trial, held without bail. They tried every trick in the book to go at the gun owner and keep him in the Gulag. But I’m happy to report that we won. Yep, I was able to get my client out of the Gulag. And let me tell you, there is no more bail in Jersey. So, if your lawyer can’t get that job done, you’re stuck. We really got into it, let me tell you. They really Page – 6 – of 7
hate us. They hate gun owners. They just want to do everything they can to keep gunowners incarcerated and disenfranchised. It’s just astounding to watch. But justice shone through, and we were able to get him out of that iron bar Hilton. So, that’s good. But beware, New Jersey ain’t stopping. That’s for sure.
Evan Nappen 25:23
So, anyway, what’s the GOFU? The GOFU this week is one that we see happen a lot. People don’t keep their mouth shut. That’s right. Shut up, people. Do not talk to the police. Do not make statements. Do not give up your Fifth Amendment right to remain silent. I can never get over why people talk. It’s astounding. Why? When you talk, all you do is dig yourself into a hole. Listen, there’s an old saying, talking about boating, the fish that opens his mouth is the one that gets caught. Okay? Remember that. Now, you may say, hey, look, I don’t have anything to hide. I’m innocent. I don’t have anything to worry about. I don’t care. Why shouldn’t I talk? Do you know every law? Not just every gun law. Do you know every law? It’s very easy for you to not know the law and say something you shouldn’t be saying. It’s also possible to end up where something gets twisted. You don’t know what they’re trying to corroborate. You may inadvertently, even though you’re innocent, corroborate things, and then it makes your life that much harder. It is dangerous, dangerous.
Evan Nappen 26:55
What you want to do is immediately say, I want my attorney. Let me talk to the police. Not you. I can’t incriminate you, but you can instantly incriminate yourself. Even though you believe you did nothing wrong. I get that. I understand. I only represent what I call law-abiding criminals. But the problem is New Jersey’s laws are so absurd. I just have to emphasize this. If you are ever read your Miranda rights, SHUT UP. Good grief. If you are read Miranda, they’re warning you. Don’t talk. Shut up. If they say you have the right to remain silent, they’re not just telling you that for fun. That means you’re a target of a criminal investigation, and you need to keep your mouth shut. They’ve just given you your last chance. You shouldn’t have said anything to begin with. But holy crap. If you are read Miranda, it is done. I want my lawyer. I’ve got nothing to say. No excuses.
Evan Nappen 28:05
And yet, people talk. Why? Why do they talk? I’ll tell you why. Because of TV. All you’ve got to do is watch TV. You see the crime shows. Oh, God. They’re yakking away over that metal table. Yak, yak, yak. I walk in and my family is watching a show, you know, and I’m like, shut up, shut up. Don’t talk. Shut up. But they keep talking. Of course, if they shut up, there wouldn’t be a show, right? But you can’t do that. You have to shut up. You got to know. Otherwise, it’s a GOFU. It’s a GOFU, and they will use everything you say against you. The best that can happen to you, if you open your mouth, the best is that it doesn’t hurt you. That’s it. It doesn’t hurt you. Well, gee, why are you saying anything when the best you can get is it doesn’t hurt you? You’re not talking your way out of anything. That ain’t going to happen. It just isn’t. And by the way, if you have defenses, if there is exculpation, what we call things to demonstrate your innocence, if you are in fact, that’s my job. Let me present it. Let me show it. Let me do it where you’re in a risk-free capacity when I do it.
Evan Nappen 29:27 Page – 7 – of 7
Do not get tripped up when they use their techniques of interrogation on you. The Reid School of Interrogation where they are trained to break you with interrogation. Oh, yeah, it happens all the time. False confessions. Known for false confessions, by the way, under the Reid School. It’s banned in parts of Europe. They can’t even use it. But here in the U.S., they can. If you don’t ever want to falsely confess to a crime, I guarantee here’s how you don’t falsely confess. You don’t talk to the police. I’m not anti-police. I’m pro-rights. Our Fifth Amendment I treasure as much as every other amendment, and so should you. Make sure you keep your mouth shut, and just ask for your attorney. That’s it. I have nothing to say. I want my attorney. Done. Protect yourself. Do not be afraid. Stand on your rights. This is Evan Nappen reminding you that the gun laws don’t protect honest citizens from criminals. They protect criminals from honest citizens.
Speaker 3 30:32
Gun Lawyer is a CounterThink Media production. The music used in this broadcast was managed by Cosmo Music, New York, New York. Reach us by emailing Evan@gun.lawyer. The information and opinions in this broadcast do not constitute legal advice. Consult a licensed attorney in your state.